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Is cultural relativism causing Americans to ignore the fact that they kill more humans than anyone else?
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supremebeing
Nov 06, 2007
9 votes
5 debaters
17
6
3


+ Add Argument

4
Yes


supremebeing
Nov 06, 2007
4 convinced
Rebuttal
I believe the media/propaganda has a great deal to do with it. Violence and death have become mainstream entertainment. We are constantly bombarded with T.V shows that make Rape, Murder, Serial Killing, Torture, etc “entertaining”. Combine that with pro-war, ultra-violent video games, and you have a recipe for disaster. Why is it ok for fictitious images of gruesome deaths/murders (CSI, Law and Order, 24, etc.) to be on basic television, while images of true death and destruction (Iraq, Africa, Afghanistan, etc) are left of the air on both cable and basic television? Compare the prime time shows through the decades. Never has there been such a high level of violent content than there is today.

Our acceptance for violence is unparalleled to anywhere else in the industrialized world. US citizens have an unquenchable thirst for violence and death, it is no wonder we have done very little to stop the mass killing and destruction our government is perpetrating throughout the world.

I am sure there were plenty of Germans during WWII that thought they were the “good guys” too.

Combine are disintegrating economy, poor healthcare, reduced funding for education, and our violent behavior…and you have a disaster waiting to happen. The biggest threat to the United States citizens is United States citizens…


 
supremebeing
Nov 06, 2007
2 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: Brett Stubbs Show

So you are saying Americans are not ignoring the fact that they have killed so many innocent people, they have accepted it as normal compared to other ruthless ruling nations?

If that is true, then why was September 11th so horrific to US citizens? Haven’t hundreds of thousands of innocent people met the same fate in Iraq due to the United States random, meaningless killing? You have not convinced me that the primary reason for Americans complacently in regards to killing people is not due to cultural relativism. And I think this argument is more than just the United States killing almost a million people in Iraq for fictitious reasons. Why is it acceptable that we kill EACH other more than any industrialized nation? Why are we so far behind in education compared to other industrialized nations? Are these two facts related? Is it stupid is as stupid does? Or is it related to the staggering amount of people living in poverty her in the US?

I am sorry, more questions than answers…

But, when you have to compare our countries death and destruction to some of the most evil and oppressive civilizations of all time in order for the United States to look good, I think you add credence to my argument. I don’t think our forefathers and those that fought for the “American Way” would be proud of what we have become.

 
+ Add Argument

5
No


Brett Stubbs
Nov 06, 2007
5 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: supremebeing Show

Are we too violent? Yes.

Are you comparing the US to Nazi Germany? Now That's a stretch. Comparing the 20,000 dead in Iraq and Afghanistan to Nazi Germany's 13 million is ridiculous. Man you can compare anything to Nazi Germany using that logic.

Compared to any other past super powers, the US is more like Bambi. Other developed countries aren't as violent "right now", because of this: They don't want to show any aggression that threatens our supremecy. Russia is not a peace loving nation. Their nation has been built on war and struggle. Everyone is just playing nice right now, because America has economic and military might. Yes, I know the US owes other govt's oodles of money, but whether those countries like it or not, their economy is dictated by ours. Or, our private sector. So they will wheel and deal with us because it is in their benefit to do so. The US is a hegemoic power. One that has been rarely seen before. They don't call us the 800 lb gorilla for nothing.

But Here are some "Past Super Powers" who killed millions more people:

1. Romans, I never use this term, but really, nuff said.
2. USSR - how many millions are burried in Siberia?
3. Communist China - ask Tibet and Burma how life is.
4. WWII Japan - ask the Philipines
5. Cambodia
6. UK Empire - Africans did not have it easy
7. Spanish Empire - how did it work out for the Aztecs,
Mayans, and Incans?
8. Nazi Germany
9. The Huns
10. Those Khans...Bush has nothing on them. They burnt Baghdad to the ground and killed over 100,000 people in a few days. Not bad.
11. OH that Alexander guy. He certainly liked killing.

Point being, in comparison to past super powers, the US is being quite tame. If it were the other way around, and the USSR had one the Cold War, we would seriously be talking about some violence.

 
vancam
Nov 06, 2007
3 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: supremebeing Show

Although I think your sentiments are right I do think you are choosing to ignore the context of media playout. I believe if content is distributed and boredered with a firm context of "entertainment" that our society is evolved enough to take that into account. Of course there is still a phycological effect attributed to the images and sounds we see but less impactful on our perception of world affairs.

The real damage is done by Fox news and its spawn masquerading as an informative channel while real harbouring right wing neo con ideals and new world order motivations.

 
Brett Stubbs
Nov 07, 2007
3 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: vancam Show

Tell that to the Irish in the 1840's. As I quote John Mitchel:

"That an island which is said to be an integral part of the richest empire on the globe…should in five years lose two and a half millions of its people (more than one fourth) by hunger, and fever the consequence of hunger, and flight beyond sea to escape from hunger…"

 
Brett Stubbs
Nov 07, 2007
3 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: vancam Show

If we are talking in terms of relativism, and since the world's population was much less then, remind me, how many millions died in hurricane Katrina?

We could keep proportions the same. Did 1/4 of katrina victims die?

Also, you can't compare a famine to a hurricane, as the damage from one occurred in one day, and the other took 4 years in the case of the potato famine.

 
Brett Stubbs
Nov 06, 2007
2 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: supremebeing Show

But I'm not comparing them to the world's most destructive civilizations, I'm only comparing them to the world's other super powers. Unless you can name a more peaceful superpower? And it must be a superpower.

We don't see it for the same reason Clinton ignored the killings in Rwanda - because it wasn't happening to us.

We noticed 9/11 because it was happening to us. If we were Iraqi citizens and lived what they are going through then we would notice it, but we're not, so we don't.



 
Brett Stubbs
Nov 07, 2007
2 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: vancam Show

I was speaking of the Zulus, but now that you mention it, slavery was pretty crappy. And especially the British Slave trade. Interesting you consider british attrocities as bringing about good, and yet america's as the ultimate evil. Quit a paradox of logic.

They both in the end had the same motive: money.

 
Brett Stubbs
Nov 07, 2007
1 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: vancam Show

They didn't have any. But f they did, we can not rule out that they would not have.

 
Brett Stubbs
Nov 07, 2007
1 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: vancam Show

Ya I know, Bambi is a stretch.

 
vancam
Nov 06, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: Brett Stubbs Show

The acts of the British Empire were relative to the the thinking of the day. African slavery had existed long before the beginning of the British Empire and Britain outlawed slavery long before America did. The British Empire shaped the modern world and brought about much good. I hardly think you can find many actions worse relative to the time than the illegal activities of this latest superpower.

 
vancam
Nov 07, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: Brett Stubbs Show

Again, if you are willing to concede relativity I presume what you are talking about is the potato famine which I could (relative to the time) compare to catastrophies like New Orleans or the increasing amounts of people that live underneath the poverty line (internationally recognised) and suffer without health care in the US.

 
vancam
Nov 07, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: Brett Stubbs Show

You also fail to point out the emergence at that time of Irish insurgents and I think we all know very well how America deals with insurgency. Put it this way, Britain didn't fire any depleated Uranium at the Irish.

 
vancam
Nov 07, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: Brett Stubbs Show

"Compared to any other past super powers, the US is more like Bambi."

I'm just pointing out that your statements aren't relative to the time period. Nothing more, nothing less.

 
vancam
Nov 08, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: Brett Stubbs Show

Now I want to watch Zulu, thank you for making me spend MORE money on Amazon dammit.

 
booyakasha
Nov 10, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: supremebeing Show

wrong. you're the one being misled by the media my friend. when was the last time the US instigated a genocide? you're also not taking into account how much good the US brings about. sure some "good" is misguided and ill-fated, but when the sh*t hits the fan, you can count on the US to be there. we pay for something like 17% of the UN. much more than any other country. when hussein invaded kuwait, who was there? sure, you may say NATO, but we all know the US was the only real force over there. what about Bosnia? the US again. somalia? and that's just the past 15-odd years. and you may think we're in it for our own interests, but we still save a lot of innocent people. every other developed country, especially the Europeans sit idly by.

 
booyakasha
Nov 10, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: supremebeing Show

"staggering" amount of people in the US in poverty. kid, you don't know what you're talking about. and the US absolutely did not kill almost 1,000,000 Iraqis. where are you getting your facts??? 1 mil iraqis may have died, but it wasn't by our hands. they're offing each other over there many, many times more than we kill them. don't come in here with your nonsense, okay. you're way out of line.

 
supremebeing
Nov 12, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: booyakasha Show

Has the United States killed almost a million people directly? No. But they are dead as a result of our invasion. The violent death rate of Iraq was lower than most place in the United States before the invasion. The United States has purposefully created a monster. Anyone with half an education predicted what Iraq would turn into if we removed their leadership and military authority. The United States has successfully destabilized one of the few countries that did not harbor terrorists. Now it has become a training ground. Now we create countless numbers of future terrorists on a daily basis. How many innocent people have died? How many of those family members blame the United States for their loved ones death? How many of those want revenge? Only a moron could believe that the invasion of Iraq had ANYTHING to do with ENDING terrorism or destroying Weapons of Mass Destruction. Unfortunately, the majority of the United States citizens have an insufficient education, and the United States government took full advantage of that fact.

By purposefully destabilizing Iraq, and creating hell on earth, the US has indirectly initiated genocide of the Iraqi people.

“When Hussein invaded Kuwait, who was there?”

When the US invaded Iraq, who was there to help the Iraqis?


 
judas
Jun 18, 2008
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: supremebeing Show

But, the American people don't accept it. A large majority of the American people -are- against this war. Our opinion is known. Why he hasn't been impeached for taking military actions without UN approval and invading a country, killing 80 thousand completely innocent, and ~1 million defending their country, is unknown to me.

Most people don't believe we are the 'good guys.' Bumper stickers say "support the troops, not the war". Of course there are some ignorant people who want to 'kill hajjis' but don't kid yourself into thinking the majority of American people accept this behavior from our president.

 


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