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Fallacies - the lament of convinceme.net
Philosophy

asimpleman
Aug 02, 2007
7 votes
8 debaters
4
2
1


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1
Debaters should lose points for fallacies


asimpleman
Aug 02, 2007
1 convinced
Rebuttal
When I first heard of convinceme.net, I was excited to find a group of people that were interested in sharing ideas, growing, and sincerely debating.

Alas, I have been somewhat disenchanted. Fallacies abound, perhaps even super-abound. Many arguments beg the question (particularly religious ones on either side), or appeal to authority, or any number of informal fallacies (see http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/) Logical fallacies abound as well (for a list see ttp://www.logicalfallacies.info/ ), particularly non sequiturs, and cum hoc fallacies.

Anyway, I thought it might be an improvement if we could take points away from debaters for making such arguments. Especially if we could inform them of what fallacy they've committed so that they could correct it.

I realize that this is probably extremely difficult and would be abused (even by the enlightened members here), but the point system does seem a little problematic. I've even seen some people "convince" others without saying anything of consequence or germane to the discussion. Just a thought.

 
juggernaut
Aug 03, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal

Warning 1
Warning 2
Warning 3
Goodbye

 
thewhitedwarf
Aug 03, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
fallacies the should be openly posted. do you think arguments should have a definant form like a policy case (Topicality, inherency (problem), harm, solvency, significance) or a syllogism (major premise, minor premise)? because if certain logical fallacies were made, the best way to get rid of that would be to synthesize arguments.

but alas, i am not a fan of either because i think debaters should just argue the topic - the points ought to come to those who HAVE the more well constructed argument.

 
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6
Debaters should not lose points for fallacies


thales
Aug 02, 2007
4 convinced
Rebuttal
There are plenty of things I think that debaters should lose points for, but the charm of a self-monitoring community is too high of a price to pay for it.

 
supremebeing
Aug 03, 2007
2 convinced
Rebuttal
News agencies report fallacies all the time and they are not punished, so I think it would be wrong to hold convince me posters to a higher standard. That being said, it is the duty of all convinceme.netters to call out BS and those that post BS, and humiliate them as much as possible.

 
thales
Aug 03, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: asimpleman Show

You can always not vote for people whose tactics you don't like--and you can publicly state your objections, scaring away other potential voters. Wouldn't that have more or less the same effect?

It's certainly not a fair system, which is why it's lucky that none of us have money or our public reputations on the line. If I may offer some totally unsolicited advice: relax about the points, and let it be fun.

 
dueonmaplestreet
Aug 03, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Its a part of debating. Whatever you can convince someone to believe works. Its how it works in the real world. And you can't necassarily prove or disprove everything and perhaps the debater guilty of using fallacies was unaware that it was a fallacy. There are plenty of things that people believe to be true that aren't necassarily true. Sometimes its just a fallacy by mistake. But in either scenario it is a risk you run when you debate.

 
tuquoque246
Aug 10, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
I think fallacies made by your opponent are a wonderful opportunity for you to tear apart his argument, potentially winning the debate for you. If it can be shown that your opponent's argument is fallacious, I would think that an open minded voter (whether they exist or not is a topic for another debate) would recognize the fact that it's not valid, and perhaps vote accordingly.

Fallacious arguments are made all the time, and it is the good debater that takes puts his knowledge of logic to good use when poor reasoning is discovered. I certainly don't think that points should be taken from people for making bad arguments. Besides the fact that enforcing the rule would be difficult, I think that people making genuinely bad arguments will be discovered and not win many debates.


 
joshlind
Aug 15, 2007
0 convinced
Rebuttal
Rebuttal to: asimpleman Show

Why don't you just win yourself points by seizing your opponents fallacious arguments, showing them to be ineffective?

 


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